Gerald Bauer
2004-08-10 21:14:56 UTC
Hello,
Ryan Lowe has written up a blog story titled "NextGen GUI Choices".
Ryan writes:
Developers seem much less concerned about common look and feel these
days. Was this ushered in by web apps, which all look different but
use simple widgets? Skinning takes this to the extreme by making
distinct looking UIs with equally complicated and custom widgets
sometimes. This can't be good for usability, can it? While new types
of widgets are interesting, it will only increase the training effort
needed to use the software.
XML markup languages are all the rage, beating limited and hard to
use WYSIWYG tools. I would say that with a minor amount of training
and/or DHTML experience a good graphic designer could become familiar
with these markups. Designers of these markup languages should keep in
mind that graphic designers and UI experts are using them, and make
them look HTML-like while seperating code from the GUI as much as
possible.
XAML does this well, XUL -- which is scattered with JavaScript
method calls on event handlers -- does not. UI designers need to be in
the driver's seat with GUIs and need to be able to manipulate them
quickly and freely. XML markup languages will enable this and free
GUIs from API calls, putting GUIs back into the control of graphic
designers and usability experts where they belong.
Cross-platform will become more, not less, of an issue. If Microsoft
insists on keeping Avalon Windows-only, it could be hanging itself ...
especially since Avalon won't be avalable in Longhorn until 2006 at
the earliest like Joel said, and won't be in mainstream use until
years later.
That's a lot of time for cross-platform solutions to catch on and
for people to get used to them. Nevermind all of the (cross-platform)
web apps that will be created in that time. XUL will lose out to cross
platform languages and runtimes/VMs -- like Java and possibly C# with
Mono -- because XUL apps are just too darned complicated at the lower
levels. XUL needs to simplify there.
Eclipse's RCP is in a position to become a web browser for rich
cross-platform applications with native widgets. Sun has no such
platform for Swing, which could be its death knell as a GUI toolkit
(developers could see it as a dead end). If Eclipse wants to get more
web app developers using SWT it needs to make it easier to use and
deploy -- a SWT XML markup language and (Gecko-like) renderer -- or
even an XML to code translator/precompiler -- could be the answer.
Java is already well entrenched with J2EE developers, so it wouldn't
be much of a switch from Java/J2EE/DHTML to Java/J2EE/SWT-XML. Eclipse
could leverage all of this Java experience on the server side to
switch these developers off the limited DHTML train and onto
fully-featured SWT native widgets and rich cross-platform applications.
Source: http://www.ryanlowe.ca/blog/archives/001734.php
What's your take on mixing markup and scripting? Or what's your
take on keeping Avalon XAML Windows-only? Do you see any viable
alternatives to Avalon XAML? Any thoughts? Any comments?
- Gerald
-------------------
Gerald Bauer
XUL Alliance | http://xul.sourceforge.net
United XAML | http://xaml.sourceforge.net
Interested in hiring Gerald Bauer? Yes, I'm available.
If you know of an opportunity in Toronto or Vancouver, please contact
me today.
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Ryan Lowe has written up a blog story titled "NextGen GUI Choices".
Ryan writes:
Developers seem much less concerned about common look and feel these
days. Was this ushered in by web apps, which all look different but
use simple widgets? Skinning takes this to the extreme by making
distinct looking UIs with equally complicated and custom widgets
sometimes. This can't be good for usability, can it? While new types
of widgets are interesting, it will only increase the training effort
needed to use the software.
XML markup languages are all the rage, beating limited and hard to
use WYSIWYG tools. I would say that with a minor amount of training
and/or DHTML experience a good graphic designer could become familiar
with these markups. Designers of these markup languages should keep in
mind that graphic designers and UI experts are using them, and make
them look HTML-like while seperating code from the GUI as much as
possible.
XAML does this well, XUL -- which is scattered with JavaScript
method calls on event handlers -- does not. UI designers need to be in
the driver's seat with GUIs and need to be able to manipulate them
quickly and freely. XML markup languages will enable this and free
GUIs from API calls, putting GUIs back into the control of graphic
designers and usability experts where they belong.
Cross-platform will become more, not less, of an issue. If Microsoft
insists on keeping Avalon Windows-only, it could be hanging itself ...
especially since Avalon won't be avalable in Longhorn until 2006 at
the earliest like Joel said, and won't be in mainstream use until
years later.
That's a lot of time for cross-platform solutions to catch on and
for people to get used to them. Nevermind all of the (cross-platform)
web apps that will be created in that time. XUL will lose out to cross
platform languages and runtimes/VMs -- like Java and possibly C# with
Mono -- because XUL apps are just too darned complicated at the lower
levels. XUL needs to simplify there.
Eclipse's RCP is in a position to become a web browser for rich
cross-platform applications with native widgets. Sun has no such
platform for Swing, which could be its death knell as a GUI toolkit
(developers could see it as a dead end). If Eclipse wants to get more
web app developers using SWT it needs to make it easier to use and
deploy -- a SWT XML markup language and (Gecko-like) renderer -- or
even an XML to code translator/precompiler -- could be the answer.
Java is already well entrenched with J2EE developers, so it wouldn't
be much of a switch from Java/J2EE/DHTML to Java/J2EE/SWT-XML. Eclipse
could leverage all of this Java experience on the server side to
switch these developers off the limited DHTML train and onto
fully-featured SWT native widgets and rich cross-platform applications.
Source: http://www.ryanlowe.ca/blog/archives/001734.php
What's your take on mixing markup and scripting? Or what's your
take on keeping Avalon XAML Windows-only? Do you see any viable
alternatives to Avalon XAML? Any thoughts? Any comments?
- Gerald
-------------------
Gerald Bauer
XUL Alliance | http://xul.sourceforge.net
United XAML | http://xaml.sourceforge.net
Interested in hiring Gerald Bauer? Yes, I'm available.
If you know of an opportunity in Toronto or Vancouver, please contact
me today.
------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~-->
Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70
http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/nhFolB/TM
--------------------------------------------------------------------~->
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/xaml-talk/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
xaml-talk-***@yahoogroups.com
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/